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greg 295509 26 Which Tractor either
Which Tractor
What new tractor would you recomend for fuel economy ,
The power between 120- 150hp

Our Tsa 135 is using sooo much diesel we r having to take an
extra 4 cans of diesel to get a full day of work.
My tsa 125 uses 4 cans less. We bought the 135 on the basis
of the engine having more power ,thus using less diesel
because it doesnt have to struggle as much, we could always
get another tsa 125 but i would like to hear everyones

Thnaks in advance
Re: Which Tractor
alot of people say fendt's are very ecomonical but they are
so expensive,try a 5465 massey ferguson dyna-4 if its a
cheap tractor you are looking for or if you have a bit more
cash a 6480,say away from john deere and also claas because
they are the same engines because they are probably worse
than your New Holland
Re: Which Tractor
What you should aim for is an engine with around
200gms/kW/hour. As Dave says, the Claas is very thirsty
indeed. The MF5465 six cylinder is better but not the best
even though using the eco PTO and dyna6 to best effect can
make a huge difference, as does the economy top gear.

The four cylinder engines up to 125 hp are generally
somewhat cheaper to run with no penalty in performance. So a
5470 with a Sisu engine is a good economical machine.
Engines within a range may also vary in economy per hp.
Class tractors above 140hp approximately are as economical
as can be expected, it is mainly the smaller Claas tractors
that are juicy.

Also it is very important to me to have a large fuel
capacity so that there is no need to refill during a ten
hour day at full power-full speed. A good rule of thumb is
to mutiply the specific fuel consumption by the power times
ten to get an idea of how much it is likely to consume over
ten hours then make sure that the tank capacity is enough to
cover this.

For instance a 260hp MF8460 is 191kW and has a sfc of
201gms/kW/h which gives a 38200gms consumtion per hour which
is 384 litres over ten hours. The tank holds 600 litres. I
suspect the equation is not so favourable for a 120hp 5465
without the optional extra tank because it is the biggest of
the range which may share a common tank. A 6465 though has a
much bigger tank for the power.

The answer is to choose tractor and options carefully. The
initial purchase price is somewhat less important than
getting a suitable machine. Try NH to see if they have a kit
to fit an auxilliary tank. Even today and unless you do a
phenomenal amount of work annually, it probably doesn't pay
to change a tractor just because it is more juicy than
another of the same power. The difference in consumption is
unlikley to be greater than 15% or 20% per unit of work done
at worst.
Re: Which Tractor
Hey huw in your head you have brain or a fuel pump with ha
Re: Which Tractor
Just ask for a demo tractor.
Mount the plough and try it out.
If you are satisfied, negotiate about a nice discount on the
"used" tractor that is standing at your place. 500 Pounds
for the reason that they don´t need to transport it anymore
is the first discount. ;-) ;-)
Re: Which Tractor
Jontiras, I have a Datatronic unit where my brain should be.


:-D :-D
Re: Which Tractor
ZETOR...ZETOR AND ZETOR;-) its cheap to buy, its cheap to
run, and its cheap to sell:-D as the old zetor joke
goes..... zetors are for life...because you cant sell it to
anybody:-D Seriously though if you can stand the jokes and
bullies, zetors are good machines!!
Re: Which Tractor
>ZETOR...ZETOR AND ZETOR its cheap to buy, its cheap to
run, and its cheap to sell as the old zetor joke
goes..... zetors are for life...because you cant sell it to
anybody <

Actually they are not cheap to buy any more. CheapER yes,
but 'cheap', no way.
On the other hand the used values are very good and better
in the UK than they have ever been. There is a very active
export market for UK Zetors to Poland and I have seen
several dealers advertise that they are looking to buy for
this market.

>Seriously though if you can stand the jokes and
bullies, zetors are good machines<

Depends by which standard they are measured by. In my
opinion they are adequate budget tractors that are not that
pleasant to drive due to poor cabs. The ergonomics are
generally poor and the noise level is at the upper end of
what is acceptable today in comparison with mainstream
models from the major brands.
There is a market for them obviously, but I would look at
the other budget brands carefully first, like McCormick,
Landini, Kubota perhaps, and even at the budget end of major
manufacturers products like the very comparable [to a Zetor]
NH TDD range and the higher quality, though basic, MF 4400
If looking at the higher hp market, over 100hp, then
something like a 10 year old NH 8240 or a MF3635 could be
bought with around 7000 hours for £8500 or so and would
never depreciate much more if well looked after. These are
really cheap hp. So cheap that they could be kept just for a
couple of hundred hours a year of heavy work while using a
more economical mainstream tractor for the bulk of
mainstream work.

Just a few of my thoughts for the day :-P
Re: Which Tractor
But you can have top of the range zetor (with loader) ok
only 88hp, but for £22.000! if that isnt cheap im a
millionare!! 10 year old ford!! huw, you cant get
warrantee and stuff, so its a bomb waiting to go off, plus
for £8500 its probably got 10,000 plus hours, buggered
tyres, and stuff so you will need about £4000 maybey to get
it "tip-top" on the otherhand- all the problems encountered
on "new" machines will be gone. and it will be nicely beded
in, but everything like linkages and pickup hitch will be
worn and wont pass those new regulations:-[ so you cant put
anyone but yourself on it, or you will probably get sued
(is that how you spell it?) and jailed maybey because of
puting somone on a unsafe machine. so its going to cost you
more than new if it goes wrong. Ok if you are going to
drive it yourself,, fix it yourself,pay for it yourself its
a good optition! but for a farming buisness it not going
to work;-) I would buy second hand actually!! I dont have
thousands to spend and im not fussy all i need from a
tractor is power for the cheapest possible price;-) I used
to have a david 1690 until it was past it and 6 cyl leylands
but zetor has been the one since about 1994 they are very
cheap to run, honest!! and parts cost pennies!!
Re: Which Tractor
Zetormatic you seem a big zetor fan. I don`t know if you try
to make zetor sales but you have right men. Sure a brand new
zetor is a million times better from a used tractor like
this 6640 because all machines in this hp category are very
very hard worked on loader works on animal feeding jobs etc.
So if you don`t have much money to spend a low cost to buy
and run zetor is the only way.:-)
Re: Which Tractor
Yes i know! thats why i have zetors! i am not millionare,
i dont want fancy stuff, just enough to get the job done,
but if i had £70,000 to spent i would maybey buy fendt or
something, but i dont so i cant:-D zetor is the one for
me, they have problems yes, but you excpect this from any
tractor? if you want ford/nh i wont stop you! i just dont
have lots of money and also I like fixing my zetors;-)
Re: Which Tractor
or try a valtra T140 eco power,they are very ecomonical
tractors and will see you to 10,000 hours plus no bother
Re: Which Tractor
Zetormatic, £22000UK for a Zetor and loader, cheap? You are
having a laugh, right?

Less than that will buy you a TDD and loader while a MF 4445
98hp with a Sigma4 [McCormick] loader fitted will cost a
maximum of £24000 for a quality [Valtra :-) ] unit. If you
look at you will see that it may be available
even cheaper which means that at 24k it may be possible to
get the unit with a Quicke Q40/MF940 for that money and it
would hold its value exceptionally if history is any
indicator of future value.
Last year at the Royal Welsh Show you could get a 4445
cheaper than a Zetor allegedly.

Anyhow, back to the original question, the average specific
optimum fuel consumption for 90 to 130 hp tractors is around
215g/kW/h. Claas tractors using DPS engines have lost the
plot here with around 135g/kW/h if my memory serves me.
These modern emmissionised engines can be a bit thirsty.
Bigger power engines seem to be somewhat more efficient for
some reason. This does not mean that they drink less fuel of
course, just that they tend to use less fuel per unit of
Re: Which Tractor
Just checked and suggest Zetormatic checks this out for

I am in no way involved with that site, just see the unit as
superb value at an amazing £22750UK with front weights, air
seat and front fenders with the Sigma4 loader. Even I might
be tempted at that price ;-) But why would I bother since I
have a loader on my MF7490 :-P
This site is also apparently selling the same model 4445
tractor without a loader but with airconditioning for £18500
which makes the one with the loader actually seem at least
£1000 over-priced. This MF dealer seems to be mad!

Now do you think a Zetor is good value at £22000?
Re: Which Tractor
but a zetor wont brake down on the way home from dealer:-D
it happened about 4 times at emyr efans!! farmer jumps in
the cab goes around the corner and bang its dead! then the
service van comes out (emyr efans is to posh to walk)
fixes the massey, farmer tries again arives home and bang it
gone again!! zetor dealer is different he jumps in cab
drives tractor to your farm! gives you some help hitching
up implements, opens the gate for you and watches you use
your new tractor with out any problems! plus massey was
actually valtra! with loader that zetor made! fendt loader
as well is made by zetor.
Re: Which Tractor
It apears it is sigma loader not trac-lift sorry its not
made by zetor (i think) But does massey have bosch
electronic hydraulics? carraro front axle? full size
passenger seat? air compressor? 4 wheel braking? front
mudguards? as standard!! No!! its extra, it costs more!
you end up paying around £25,000 for full spec version, and
in the end it is only massey because it is red, all the rest
is valtra!!
Re: Which Tractor
also the cab looks like crap!!
Re: Which Tractor
I have no reason to suppose that a Zetor is more economical
or reliable than a Valtra based MF or indeed a NH TDD [built
by Turk Tractors] as I have no experience of either modern
models. All are fairly basic, even your so-called
top-of-the-range Zetor, and I am not really into basic
models. They just do a job and certainly don't turn me on.
As for delivering the tractor, I expect my dealer to deliver
a new tractor by truck unless I get an extra`discount :-P

What has Emyr Evans, the MF dealer done to upset you? I hope
you can back up your allegations if he comes gunning for you
I find almost all dealers try their best to please although
as I deal with farmers in a commercial way as well as
farming myself and once being a fair sized farm contractor,
I find that many farmers expect everything for nothing.
Indeed some do not pay even fair bills, almost on principle.
Of all the different proffessions I deal with, farmers and
farm contractors in my locality are the least financially
proffessional. Many are indeed near crooks. I have only ever
dealt with one dealer who I thought tried to be a crook at
my expense.
Re: Which Tractor
I hate the little ba*tard!! ever since i went there to buy
a digger, i bought it, went to get it and it wasnt there!!
he had sold it for more than i had paid for it! i managed
to get my money back but he insted i took another digger in
its place! this is were the story ends he is a twat i hate
him, simple, massey comes after this its a simple rule- i
hate emyr efans + he sells massey = i then hate massey as
well (because of him) for example= if you hate zetor + i
like zetor = you dont like me? Its his fault i hate massey
not massey as a tractor i quite liked massey before that!
If he was to kiss his arse stick his head in a oven and piss
off then i would forgive him!
Re: Which Tractor
> But does massey have bosch
electronic hydraulics? carraro front axle? full size
passenger seat? air compressor? 4 wheel braking? front
mudguards? as standard!! No!! its extra, it costs more!
you end up paying around £25,000 for full spec version,<

Well if you read my comment and the web site carefully you
will see they are fairly well specified but I doubt if they
have Bosch electro hydraulics and I think this would be a
disadvantage at this level. In any case most users of this
type of tractor would have little or no idea of what draft
control is, when to use it or how to use it, let alone know
how it worked in order to use it properly. Most would only
use the links for lift and drop work and the word
'electronic' would send them running in the opposite
direction as fast as their legs would carry them :-D

> and
in the end it is only massey because it is red, all the rest
is valtra!!<

At least it is not a Zetor :-P :-P
Re: Which Tractor
as my sister would say= "Whatever" i dont really care!!
its clear to me you dont want the massey or the zetor you
are just pissing about (like me) we dont want a new
tractor, we are happy with the one we bought last time i
quite fancy the massey actually if it had a better cab i
might consider it but i wont be going to emyr efans to get
Re: Which Tractor
>I hate the little ba*tard!!< SNIPPO

That post doesn't make pleasant reading Zetormatic! I
respectfully suggest that you have a problem and [hint] its
probably not Emyr Evans ;-)
Chill out man! Bearing a grudge will likely shorten your
life potential considerably, and linking that grudge to a
product is, at the very least, not sensible.
Re: Which Tractor
Talking of life- 3 of my friends, neighbours ect.. who
drive sg2 cabed john deeres a 3640,2850 and a 2140 all was
well, but the trouble started when they all were rushed to
hospital with high blood pressure!!! it begs the question,
does the john deeres have something to do with it??
Re: Which Tractor
>as my sister would say= "Whatever" i dont really care!!
its clear to me you dont want the massey or the zetor you
are just pissing about (like me) we dont want a new
tractor, we are happy with the one we bought last time i
quite fancy the massey actually if it had a better cab i
might consider it but i wont be going to emyr efans to get

I am always on the look for a new tractor and the next one
will be something around 90 to 100 hp in the reasonably
compact and economical end of the scale to replace my John
Deere 2140 [with 9500 hours]on the mixer wagon. It will need
IPTO, a reasonable oil flow, at least one and ideally four
powershift steps, a power-shuttle, be low profile or
reasonably low [if the Deere fails or is exchanged] and with
a good visibility of the pick-up hitch. Price is always
secondary to specification and value when I choose a
tractor. I don't care if it costs up to 40% more than
another if the spec is right and the price is justified by
the features I want and need because it will be kept for a
very long time unless it turns out to be a dog for some

The last two dogs of a tractors I had were indeed Massey
Ferguson 590 and 595 models and these put me off the brand
for very many years, although I always lusted after a 3000
series but lacked the confidence to buy. The next tractor
will probably be a NH, Deere or a MF and it will not be a
bottom of the range model, not a 4400 MF or a NH TDD or any
Zetor. It will be heavy duty, so a TSa, 5400 or 6400MF or a
6*20 with carefully chosen options are the most likely.
Will not consider McCormick, Landini, Kubota, Claas or any
other, even though they might be perfectly good
mechanically. I wish I could like a McCormick but I suspect
the stability of the company, rightly or wrongly. I have
seen too many brands disappear over the years with
consequences for their resale value.
Re: Which Tractor
9500 hours? thats nothing Huw;-) but at 10,000 you will
need a new pto clutch pack unless it allready had one?
this tractor should last you 15,000 hours easy;-) unless it
is shity "opu" cab one;-) Anyways I thought 500 series was
good massey! it was the most popular around here! until
6000 series came along, the 3000 series never really took
off, You call tsa heavy duty??:-D no way!! if I put
massey sticker on zetor would you buy it:-P I quite like
that massey huw but the cab is tiny:-\ i nearly bought a
similar valtra the other day but ex demo zetor looked
better at the time:-[
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